Are Fundamentalists Outbreeding Us?
Mrs Robinson printable version print page     Bookmark and Share
Sat Aug 19, 2006 at 01:12:29 PM EST
Deacon Tim's excellent piece on Anglican orthodoxy ("Babies, Anglicans, and the End of the Reformation") alludes briefly to a meme that seems to be gaining currency in progressive religious circles -- and probably shouldn't be.

The notion that fundamentalists have more babies, and will thus win in the end by sheer force of numbers, is one that they've been gleefully promulgating among their own faithful for the past couple years. We, however, should not be helping that idea take legs and spread into the mainstream, because it's probably only "truthy" at best.

It is true that the retention rate (the rate at which children raised in the faith stick with it as adults) is somewhat higher among fundamentalist Christians than it is among mainstream Protestant groups. However, it's still not good: the odds are probably better than even that kids raised in either group will not be practicing in those same groups by midlife.

In particular, over 50% of all fundamentalist kids who attend secular college have left the fold entirely after four years. (The bulk of that group leaves in the first two.) This is, in fact, why fundamentalist parents hate sending their kids to secular schools -- how are you gonna keep 'em down on the farm after they've seen State U?

But college isn't the only place attrition is high. A lot of people who leave deeply conservative religions make the break at other life transition points. Leaving home (even if not for college), marriage, widowhood or divorce, the death of a parent, and retirement all seem to be major turning points where our religious beliefs either sustain us, or prove to be disappointingly inadequate to the job.

The midlife crisis of the late 30s may be the biggest one of all. At this point in life, we have the confidence to question authority, and the seriousness of mind to demand good answers. It's a time of earnest seeking and self-creation. While some people are drawn to authoritarian religion as part of this phase, it's often a temporary experiment that's over in a few years (the long-term retention rate for these folks isn't great) and their families seldom join them. At the same time, those who've grown up in these churches can be drawn away from them during this period of seeking. They're likely to be gone for good -- and they usually take their spouses and half-grown children with them when they go.

Taken altogether, I'd be surprised if one in three kids born into fundamentalist homes are still practicing the same faith at 45. If that guess is anywhere near accurate, these families would have to raise six babies to ensure that there were still two adults in the pews half a century hence. While they may have one or two more kids on average, that's still nowhere near the rate needed to achieve this.

The current best research (I think it's Pew's stuff) reveals the real trend we need to discuss: The number of Americans who consider themselves secular, and have no church affiliation, has been steadily rising for the past couple generations and shows no signs of slowing. While the mainstream churches have taken the bulk of that hit, this fact still puts the lie to fundamentalist crowing that they're going to somehow outbreed us.

Let's not help them validate this idea. There's plenty of reason to doubt its essential truth.




Display:
a great point. It's not all about birth. It is mostly about the journey after birth.

by Carlos on Sat Aug 19, 2006 at 01:49:56 PM EST

The religious self-identification studies that are the largest and most reliable are the CUNY ARIS studies. I wrote about them (among other times and places), inferences to draw, and their impact on the future HERE

by sdanielmorgan on Mon Aug 21, 2006 at 12:00:11 PM EST

..........that so many Fundamentalists think that the "only" way to have large families is by becoming prolific "breeders."

I can think of two "justifications" at work here, both of which are far from healthy.

First, keeping women pregnant and/or nursing, both of which are tremendous drains on a woman's physical and emotional energy (as I know from personal experience), is a time-honored way of controlling them. The old "barefoot and pregnant" garbage just refuses to go away.

Second--and this is truly sickening--far too often there's an underlying racist agenda. The aim isn't just to outpopulate the unbelievers, it's to outpopulate the nonwhites. That attitude isn't the exclusive property of extremists like Christian Identity who state it outright; it influences many others as well, including some who would be horrified to admit it even to themselves, much less openly.

Otherwise, it seems to me that if they wanted to put their professed love of children (not to mention Christ's teaching and example of love for all "the least of these" and downplaying blood ties) into action, or if they simply wanted to bring up a whole tribe of little Fundamentalists to outpopulate the rest of us (whether or not that actually works), after having a couple of their own biological children they'd look around and see how many children all over the world are in need of good homes and loving families, and adopt as many more as they wanted.

I myself gave birth to one child and realized I don't have the "gift for parenthood" (although I wish to God I did; early on in our marriage, my ex and I talked seriously about adopting a child or two eventually). I wouldn't take a billion dollars for my son, but I knew better than to go through it again. To those who love children and do have the "gift for parenthood," biology shouldn't matter. To keep on squeezing out babies while so many children beg in the streets, starve, and die of preventable or curable diseases isn't love; it's sentimentality mixed with selfishness.


by anomalous4 on Sun Aug 27, 2006 at 12:31:58 PM EST


I have four children, three of them triplets!  While we never set out to have a big family, we have one, thanks be to God.  All the churches we visit love to see us coming- the pastor knows there will be a full chancel when Children's Time comes!

Just to let you know one mainline Christian is doing his share of keeping the Church full!

by Steven D. Martin on Tue Aug 29, 2006 at 06:58:56 AM EST

My parents only planned to have two, but I suppose God had other ideas.

While I thought when I was a kid that three younger (unplanned) siblings equalled one zoo, now that we're all adults I'm glad I've got 'em.

My mom always said she wouldn't take a million dollars for any of us, but you couldn't pay her a million bucks to have another one--and that she hoped she'd only end up with 8 grandchildren. We got that part right, at least! ---grin---

I still think cranking out 8, or 9, or 17 (like a family that's been featured several times on Discovery Health) when so many other kids need homes and families is ridiculous--but that's only one woman's opinion.............


by anomalous4 on Sat Sep 09, 2006 at 12:30:08 PM EST
Parent




WWW Talk To Action


Cognitive Dissonance & Dominionism Denial
There is new research on why people are averse to hearing or learning about the views of ideological opponents. Based on evaluation of five......
By Frederick Clarkson (375 comments)
Will the Air Force Do Anything To Rein In Its Dynamic Duo of Gay-Bashing, Misogynistic Bloggers?
"I always get nervous when I see female pastors/chaplains. Here is why everyone should as well: "First, women are not called to be pastors,......
By Chris Rodda (203 comments)
The Legacy of Big Oil
The media is ablaze with the upcoming publication of David Grann's book, Killers of the Flower Moon. The shocking non fiction account of the......
By wilkyjr (111 comments)
Gimme That Old Time Dominionism Denial
Over the years, I have written a great deal here and in other venues about the explicitly theocratic movement called dominionism -- which has......
By Frederick Clarkson (101 comments)
History Advisor to Members of Congress Completely Twists Jefferson's Words to Support Muslim Ban
Pseudo-historian David Barton, best known for his misquoting of our country's founders to promote the notion that America was founded as a Christian nation,......
By Chris Rodda (113 comments)
"Christian Fighter Pilot" Calls First Lesbian Air Force Academy Commandant a Liar
In a new post on his "Christian Fighter Pilot" blog titled "BGen Kristin Goodwin and the USAFA Honor Code," Air Force Lieutenant Colonel Jonathan......
By Chris Rodda (144 comments)
Catholic Right Leader Unapologetic about Call for 'Death to Liberal Professors' -- UPDATED
Today, Donald Trump appointed C-FAM Executive Vice President Lisa Correnti to the US Delegation To UN Commission On Status Of Women. (C-FAM is a......
By Frederick Clarkson (126 comments)
Controlling Information
     Yesterday I listened to Russ Limbaugh.  Rush advised listeners it would be best that they not listen to CNN,MSNBC, ABC, CBS and......
By wilkyjr (118 comments)
Is Bannon Fifth-Columning the Pope?
In December 2016 I wrote about how White House chief strategist Steve Bannon, who likes to flash his Catholic credentials when it comes to......
By Frank Cocozzelli (251 comments)
Ross Douthat's Hackery on the Seemingly Incongruous Alliance of Bannon & Burke
Conservative Catholic writer Ross Douthat has dissembled again. This time, in a February 15, 2017 New York Times op-ed titled The Trump Era's Catholic......
By Frank Cocozzelli (65 comments)
`So-Called Patriots' Attack The Rule Of Law
Every so often, right-wing commentator Pat Buchanan lurches out of the far-right fever swamp where he has resided for the past 50 years to......
By Rob Boston (161 comments)
Bad Faith from Focus on the Family
Here is one from the archives, Feb 12, 2011, that serves as a reminder of how deeply disingenuous people can be. Appeals to seek......
By Frederick Clarkson (177 comments)
The Legacy of George Wallace
"One need not accept any of those views to agree that they had appealed to real concerns of real people, not to mindless, unreasoning......
By wilkyjr (70 comments)
Betsy DeVos's Mudsill View of Public Education
My Talk to Action colleague Rachel Tabachnick has been doing yeoman's work in explaining Betsy DeVos's long-term strategy for decimating universal public education. If......
By Frank Cocozzelli (80 comments)
Prince and DeVos Families at Intersection of Radical Free Market Privatizers and Religious Right
This post from 2011 surfaces important information about President-Elect Trump's nominee for Secretary of Education, Betsy DeVos. -- FC Erik Prince, Brother of Betsy......
By Rachel Tabachnick (218 comments)

Respect for Others? or Political Correctness?
The term "political correctness" as used by Conservatives and Republicans has often puzzled me: what exactly do they mean by it? After reading Chip Berlin's piece here-- http://www.talk2action.org/story/2016/7/21/04356/9417 I thought about what he explained......
MTOLincoln (253 comments)
Fear
What I'm feeling now is fear.  I swear that it seems my nightmares are coming true with this new "president".  I'm also frustrated because so many people are not connecting all the dots! I've......
ArchaeoBob (107 comments)
"America - love it or LEAVE!"
I've been hearing that and similar sentiments fairly frequently in the last few days - far FAR more often than ever before.  Hearing about "consequences for burning the flag (actions) from Trump is chilling!......
ArchaeoBob (214 comments)
"Faked!" Meme
Keep your eyes and ears open for a possible move to try to discredit the people openly opposing Trump and the bigots, especially people who have experienced terrorism from the "Right"  (Christian Terrorism is......
ArchaeoBob (165 comments)
More aggressive proselytizing
My wife told me today of an experience she had this last week, where she was proselytized by a McDonald's employee while in the store. ......
ArchaeoBob (163 comments)
See if you recognize names on this list
This comes from the local newspaper, which was conservative before and took a hard right turn after it was sold. Hint: Sarah Palin's name is on it!  (It's also connected to Trump.) ......
ArchaeoBob (169 comments)
Unions: A Labor Day Discussion
This is a revision of an article which I posted on my personal board and also on Dailykos. I had an interesting discussion on a discussion board concerning Unions. I tried to piece it......
Xulon (180 comments)
Extremely obnoxious protesters at WitchsFest NYC: connected to NAR?
In July of this year, some extremely loud, obnoxious Christian-identified protesters showed up at WitchsFest, an annual Pagan street fair here in NYC.  Here's an account of the protest by Pagan writer Heather Greene......
Diane Vera (130 comments)
Capitalism and the Attack on the Imago Dei
I joined this site today, having been linked here by Crooksandliars' Blog Roundup. I thought I'd put up something I put up previously on my Wordpress blog and also at the DailyKos. As will......
Xulon (331 comments)
History of attitudes towards poverty and the churches.
Jesus is said to have stated that "The Poor will always be with you" and some Christians have used that to refuse to try to help the poor, because "they will always be with......
ArchaeoBob (149 comments)
Alternate economy medical treatment
Dogemperor wrote several times about the alternate economy structure that dominionists have built.  Well, it's actually made the news.  Pretty good article, although it doesn't get into how bad people could be (have been)......
ArchaeoBob (90 comments)
Evidence violence is more common than believed
Think I've been making things up about experiencing Christian Terrorism or exaggerating, or that it was an isolated incident?  I suggest you read this article (linked below in body), which is about our great......
ArchaeoBob (214 comments)

More Diaries...




All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective companies. Comments, posts, stories, and all other content are owned by the authors. Everything else © 2005 Talk to Action, LLC.